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[–] • 9 pts

I can watch a movie that I've seen before, but that doesn't mean I played a part in the production.

God is outside of time, he is the Alpha and the Omega. He already knows how this movie ends.

[–] • 1 pt

If you've already seen the movie you should also know the ending

[–] • 0 pt

so free will could be defined as our limited number of choices always leading to the same culminating end? is that really free will? i suppose it is OUR choices of the limited number

[–] • 1 pt

Unless you're crazy and your decisions have nothing to do with circumstances, why wouldn't you make the same choices given the same circumstances? God would know all the circumstances, so wouldn't be surprised by anyone's decisions. Free-will involves perception of what is and choosing what you think will best meet your goals. None of those is unpredictable.

[–] • 1 pt

Just by turning right out of your driveway instead of left alters your future. That was your choice, God had nothing to do with it. But I believe it is deeper than that. It's not about the daily trappings of this world.

When God speaks of free will, I believe he is speaking of whether or not we freely choose to love him and accept him in to our heart. God doesn't follow us around like some stalker begging us to love him, that would not be true love. He gives us free will to love him or reject him.

[–] • 1 pt

Simple. An Animal still has 'free will' according to it's Natural instincts, even or despite of living on a Large African Wildlife savanna reserve. We exert our Free will on this Earthy realm. Which We can not physically leave.

[–] • 4 pts (edited )

No. You lack serious understanding of logic if you think what you assert is true. You also lack the ability to view Faith as what it is. You sound like you're posting a (((gotcha))) post as though it matters. There's more truth behind Faith than there is truth behind science. Science lacks all understand and capability to explain in part or whole the beginnings of things and ends of things.

[–] • 2 pts

not really, i just figured could have an actual discussion. my point of view isnt slightly changed from what you said, there is no depth. also this was not about gotcha i legitimately would like to discuss this, in my philosophy it seems contradictory edit: replied before i observed your edit

[–] • 1 pt

Because FAITH supersedes laws of physics 'because' that's what FAITH means. Logic, proofs etc. have no place in discussions of Faith and as I stated: they always feel forced, jewish and in bad... faith. These are questions an 8 year old boy has when he doesn't want to go to Christmas Mass with the family.

[–] • 2 pts

If you truly believe faith always supercedes laws of physics I have a 100ft balcony for you to jump from. 😂

Philosophy is much broader than just faith or logic.

Logic and faith always have a place in discussion and anyone saying otherwise is biased and driven by either's agenda more than the other.

If you go full retard for anti-logic you get a flat earther that thinks the sun works as a spotlight because Nuclear Fusion is a concept beyond their understanding.

If you go full retard for anti-faith you get our modern Sodom & Gomorrah because believing morals and believing in goodness as a remedy for degeneracy is a concept beyond their understanding.

Truth only comes when you can reconcile the whole coin without engaging in infantile competition betwixt their two extremes. The worlds greatest scientists and philosophers tend to share a balanced and mature outlook on such discussion rather than arguments of "MUH SCIENCE, MUH FAITH, MUH LOGIC, MUH BELIEF".

Leave those shit-tier arguments to the masses if you'd like to improve. After all blind belief in science is bad faith & using logic to come to the conclusion that there's something beyond our understanding that lies at the beginning & end of everything we know is just sound logic.

[–] • 0 pt

not everyone went to church, experiencing faith late in life may make you look stupid or a shill to others does not negate the desire to learn

[–] [deleted] • -1 pt

Then faith is for idiots who prefer to be told "just so" stories rather than have their daddies confess that they just plain don't know the answer to every question.

Sometimes the beginning of wisdom is to answer "I don't know. Maybe there's some way to find out..."

[–] • 2 pts

It is because we are different than the rest of God's creation. Where it is very easy to derive the motivations and movements of an animal, humans are a spark of the divine. They can reason and contemplate their own existence. They can restrain themselves against their tendencies. We have obvious free will derived from God.

[–] • 2 pts

Belief that God has predestined your fate is called Calvinism.

Calvin from Calvin and Hobbes was named after Calvin of Calvinism. Calvin of Calvin and Hobbes seems predestined to get into trouble. I don't know what I'm doing.

[–] • 2 pts

The universe responds to your thoughts. You live many lives. God may have created the universe but there is no involvement of any god in your daily life. What people mistake as their god helping them is actually the universe responding to your emotions. Everything you do good or bad comes back to you in this life or the next.

[–] • 1 pt

Everything you do good or bad comes back to you

That sounds a lot like "karma", which IMO is just weaklings excuse for not standing up for themselves.

[–] • 1 pt

We are ONE with God, he gave us free will AND the power to create our own reality. You form your own reality, because you are one with the creator.

[–] • 1 pt

All knowing doesn't mean God is just watching a movie that would be identical on repeat viewings, God can see all possible outcomes of our free will just as we can see a chain of causality in the past and speculate how things may have turned out if one event were different God knows and can see that chain of causality stretch into our future. Free will and omniscience aren't mutually exclusive.

[–] • 1 pt

We work inside a set of rules. Our free will cannot break them but because these rules are vast we think we overlord.

[–] • 1 pt

Why is an omnipotent god mutually exclusive with free will? Knowing what people's reactions to things will be doesn't mean they didn't make that choice. Knowing my kid will scream if he grazes his knee doesn't mean it was out of his control.

[–] • 1 pt

The way I see it, we have the gift of free will. But God sees the permutations of all things. No surprises to him. But if we knew the mind of God there would be no free will.

[–] • 1 pt

Foreknowledge is not the same as Predestined. The real question is, why did God create evil and suffering?

[–] • 0 pt

how can you have good without evil? if we were automatons we would have no evil, but we would also have no good. without the potential to do evil you cannot have the potential to commit good.

[–] • 0 pt

You forget that all things are possible to God. There is no 'need' which is greater than the Lord, else he is not omnipotent. He did not 'need' to create us. He did not 'need' to create evil. He chose to do both. This was the version of creation he desired - one with suffering and death. The question is 'why did God desire that evil should exist, that man should fall, that Lucifer should fall'? That's the really difficult question.

[–] • 0 pt

how can a coin with one side exist while still calling it a coin? a coin with one side is a sphere

[–] • 0 pt

that would be like saying that god made the sun but he also made your shadow, you cannot have one without the other. you need to have a point of reference for good or evil to exist, you would need to abandon free will for either to go away.

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