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What the actual fuck. I just can't believe that none of these companies are able to figure out their primer shortage. How difficult is it to make ammo? People can make it at home!

Everyone is talking about Biden's gun bill or whatever, not realizing that without ammo (and affordable ammo to actually practice) gun ownership is pretty much useless. If it costs more than a dollar a round, people will just use guns only for hunting, or will be horribly out of practice and not proficient if they have to defend themselves.

Ammo is as important as the actual weapon.

What the actual fuck. I just can't believe that none of these companies are able to figure out their primer shortage. How difficult is it to make ammo? People can make it at home! Everyone is talking about Biden's gun bill or whatever, not realizing that without ammo (and affordable ammo to actually practice) gun ownership is pretty much useless. If it costs more than a dollar a round, people will just use guns only for hunting, or will be horribly out of practice and not proficient if they have to defend themselves. Ammo is as important as the actual weapon.

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[–] [deleted] • 17 pts

yeah they are artificially limiting production. I called it at the beginning of the supposed "shortage".

[–] • 9 pts

You guys are so low brow its painful... If everyone uses 1000 bullets a year and you have 100 people shooting then you need to make 100000 bullets a year. Now imagine a retard is elected president and 200 more people buy a gun and now everyone uses 3000 ammo a year.

Its once again simple economics, people buy (a LOT) more than what is produced. There is no artificial limitation ffs stop being niggers.

And for the OP saying ammo is sooo easy to make people even makenit at home... I'm not even going to feed the troll.

[–] • 4 pts

In three words: inelastic supply curve.

Precision machining is hard to scale rapidly, and anyone who think ammunition isnt precision machining needs to look at the the spec tolerances.

There's a reason every third world shithole has a cottage industry in AK manufacture but imports ammo. Russia and former East Bloc nations even produce steel cased ammo especially for these loose tolerance/"hard extraction" AKs made by Abdul in a garage. Sure, it fouls more because it doesnt seal to the chamber worth a darn , but better a dirty garage AK than a jammed one.

If Abdul could manufacture virgin ammo in his garage, there wouldnt be a massive ammo export industry.

[–] • 3 pts (edited )

most of those people that change their gun activity in response to disarment attempts might use a only a few cases or one bulk box before going back to their prior gun apathy, so one thousand rounds a year is a quite a bit much.

[–] • 0 pt

in my country were limited to 2000 rounds a year and i can assure you that without this restriction i would shoot them every month...ammo goes fast.people i the us dont usually buy a box but a crate of thousands, and now they want to buy even more because "muh gobermant artibichal supply" and dont realize they feed the problem.

[–] [deleted] • 0 pt

I bought my first guns last year and shot well over a thousand rounds.

Then I lost everything in a boating accident, so I don’t really care. I’ll just sit in piles of ammo and maybe pick up another gun at some point.

[–] • 0 pt

And for the OP saying ammo is sooo easy to make people even makenit at home

With the supplies I could setup fully automated ammo production in my own workshop in a couple of weeks.

C or python, image recognition, a few cheap microcomputers, digital scale, servos, respective tools, and a lathe for making parts among other things.

It'd be harder than that, but easier than you might assume.

Doesn't prove anything of course. But you gotta ask, how high is the demand that others aren't selling into the market?

[–] [deleted] • 2 pts (edited )

With the supplies I could

That's exactly what he's referring to. It's like someone saying you can't fly and you're like "oh yeah? Well if I had wings I totally could".

[–] • 2 pts

You have metal presses and draws in your garage? Even making the casing is pretty involved: https://www.petersoncartridge.com/technical-information/drawing-brass/

[–] • 1 pt

Brass, lead, steel, powder.

All of these are components needed to produce ammo.

Asinine to think "I could produce it in my garage." Without preformed primers, powder, & brass, you and making bumb-kiss.

It is also a steep learning curve to re-load, and the initial up front costs can easily run into the thousands.

[–] • 0 pt

Blasting caps are dangerous as fuck to produce. This is where the supply shortage is.

If you think you can quickly setup and safely make those in your garage, you're fooling yourself brother.

[–] • 8 pts

When nobody is working there is nobody to produce products.

Here's one for you. Rockstar energy drinks are back ordered 2 months.

How does that fit your conspiracy?

[–] • 15 pts

Rockstar energy drinks are back ordered 2 months.

And every store in my state has Rockstar energy drinks, and at normal prices.....

[–] • 5 pts

The analogy only goes so far though.

There may be a solid 30 million Rockstar Energy drinkers in America today, but I'd be willing to bet that this 30 million isn't stockpiling a closet of Rockstar drink.

Meanwhile, I personally know half a dozen people with a literal closet of ammo of varying calibers and are not stopping any habits.

[–] • 3 pts

Rockstar example, while interesting, doesn't fit this situation.

Rockstar was bought by Pepsi. Pepsi never got caught telling people to be less White.

Business owners know that people won't stop drinking their flavored sugar water and saw that there will be a huge jump in demand for that brand, so orders went through the roof.

Meanwhile, no one will spend money to increase production of non-Coke products. They know this is a short term thing because people will eventually forget about it.

[–] • 8 pts

It's artificially engineered. In the same way there are shortages on lumber and many other goods. Capacity limits exist because of the virus hoax. It is then helping to fuel hyper inflation and goods shortages.

In the case of ammo, hording remains a huge problems. These shitbags only further drive up demand and reduce supply. Add to this, everyone senses the pending war, millions of new gun owners are demanding hundreds of millions of ammo. The numbers grow large very quickly.

Altogether, it's a very bad situation.

[–] • 4 pts

How can you call hoarders shitbags in one sentence and then in the very next sentence say we need to stock up for war? Where's the line between hoarder and prudent prepping?

[–] • 3 pts

Most of these guys are doing so for price gouging down the road. The term is profiteering. Universally agreed they are shit bags.

[–] • 3 pts

He's pissed off as hell that he can't buy any ammo because he didn't have the foresight to stock up.

[–] • 2 pts

The dude who has 40 guns and more ammo than he could ever shoot in a decade is keeping other people from getting it.

[–] • -1 pt

Hoarding?

So, would you consider someone who lived through this in 2008 & again in 2012 buying extra ammo every single trip to the store....every time....because they KNEW a time would come when it was gonna happen again....would you consider that HOARDING.

How about we consider you a DUMBASS for not buying when it was good? ONE YEAR AGO you could buy whatever you wanted at reasonable prices!

Why didn't you put a couple of thousand into your own ammo HOARD instead of whining and bitching about there being no ammo?

Dumbass.

[–] • -1 pt

Dumbass. Why do idiots like you have to strawman to make your point? Oh ya, because you're dishonest.

The vast majority of people are not hoarders. Fucking moron. This is already pretty clear in my previous comment along these lines.

So fuck off with your stupidity...

[–] • 6 pts

Here's one for you. Rockstar energy drinks are back ordered 2 months.

How come I can go to Costco and see 5 pallets of Rockstar but I can't see ammo anywhere?

[–] • 2 pts

Because nobody is panic buying rockstar, and we dont have a few million new rockstar drinkers suddenly.

[–] • 0 pt

Because Costco doesn't sell ammo. ;P

Also people don't stockpile soda.

You only think there is a bullet shortage because a dozen millionaires bought a year's worth of product.

[–] • 3 pts

ya... I wish there were some evil conspiracy so we could find it and smash it. The problem is, even at these prices, ammo is still flying off the fucking shelves. I grit my teeth and pick up a few boxes at the range once per month- long are the days gone when "Sunday-Gunday" was every Sunday.

Biden's gun noises don't help anymore than the labor shortages and crazy accumulated demand. If ammo prices were back where they were a year ago, I would buy 10k rounds today. As long as 5 million other people feel the same way, the shortage will continue.

[–] • 6 pts

This guy gets it. Every month a new record is set for gun sales and new gun owners. 5 million new gun owners in 2020, at 100 rounds of ball and 50 of HPs is an insane amount of ammo. Add on the lack of raw materials and the fact that Remington was shut down for a bit, its a fucking nightmare. Chill out and buy 100 RDS a month

[–] • 1 pt

Was going to get MyPillows for Mother's Day and there is a "nationwide foam shortage".

[–] [deleted] • 0 pt

There's also apparently a shortage of ketchup packets because more people are getting drive-thru.

It's not due to profiteering or hoarding, but changing habits. This past year has seen a huge insurgence in gun sales - especially first-time gun owners - each buying thousands of rounds as soon as they find them.

And - I'm talking out of my ass - but I assume ammunition manufacturers are seeing rising costs of raw material and such. There's probably inter-industry competition too - if you offer a higher price for raw goods, your ammo may cost more, but it takes your competitor out and someone will buy it.

[–] • 6 pts

Ammo shortage

How the fuck them hood niggas keep on shooting each other

[–] • 8 pts

They steal it from white people

[–] • 2 pts

That and they never practice. They'll have a handful of rounds they stole off some dude's truck's floor when he stole the radio in it and have half of them loaded up and the other half god-knows where. And that's where they'll stay until the day they use them up and start running.

[–] • 3 pts

For our sakes, I'm really glad that they don't understand ammo, and almost always just use fmj practice ammo.

[–] • 3 pts (edited )

Coming to an end soon.

Winchester is almost back at capacity.

They were closed for a 2nd bankruptcy restructure.

[–] • 3 pts

How in the world are they in bankruptcy in this climate??

[–] • 0 pt

Same way Remington went out of business

[–] • 3 pts

Instead of being behind on the supply/demand curve, next time it's everywhere and on sale: buy it cheap-stock it deep and stock the fuck up.

It's not a conspiracy.

It's not because of "shitbags" who are hoarding.

It's the supply/demand curve at work: additional pressure due to people who did not stock up when it was widely and cheaply available. It will be again, and you will have an opportunity to correct that mistake. I went into this feeling overly comfortable with over 22,000 rounds of 5.56 and have that sold down to less than 5,000 rounds. I might sell more. There's a lot of new gun owners with no ammo that could use it.

[–] • 1 pt

It's not because of "shitbags" who are hoarding. It's the supply/demand curve at work: additional pressure due to people who did not stock up when it was widely and cheaply available.

If everyone went out in 2019 and bought the ammo they needed for 2020 and 2021, you'd just have this shortage in 2019. If they aren't making enough rounds for everyone to stockpile now, they sure as shit weren't in 2019.

[–] • 2 pts

Ammo is arguably more valuable than the weapon itself.

With proper maintenance, a single firearm can use thousnads of rounds of ammunition.

[–] • 2 pts (edited )

If they push through an ammo background check and lgs tack on fees for a box of 9mm it'll come back down.

And if you live in one of the few states that will pass nullification laws you'll be sitting pretty.

As usual, the answer is to move to a red supermajority/white state.

But to your point no it's not normal and why would it be? This isn't just a bad political climate for guns this is a fundamental change (i.e. the end as we know it) of America.

[–] • 0 pt

If they push through an ammo background check and lgs tack on fees for a box of 9mm it'll come back down.

California's had both for awhile and there isn't ammo here.

[–] • 1 pt

California is mostly anti-gun liberals anyway. The effect on the whole country would be different.

[–] • 2 pts

I just can't believe that none of these companies are able to figure out their primer shortage.

I'd imagine the problem isn't just the ammo manufacturers themselves, it's all the other supply chain issues. Like supposed they need a replacement stepper motor for one of their machines, but the company that makes the stepper motor has none left, because the company that makes the semiconductors was shut down for half a year.

The lesson is that you can't shut down an economy without unforseen consequences.

[–] • 2 pts

Last time ammo supply got short the manufacturers made more and the price went down. They don't want to repeat that "mistake." The problem is a lack of competition in the ammunition market.

There's a simple test for any market for whether it's competitive or not. Can the largest manufacturer stop producing without affecting the price? If the answer is "no," then the market isn't competitive. In a healthy free market there are enough producers of any given commodity that one producer doesn't have the power to affect prices.

[–] • 1 pt

That's a good test.

[–] • 2 pts

If you're an ammo producer and people have no choice but to buy your ammo, why wouldn't you want the current situation to continue? You can run your existing factory at full bore and make record profits. If you take all that extra money and invest in more factories you're just going to drive down the price and your margin per unit will decrease.

[–] • 0 pt

Lead mined from other countries has a hand in it also

[–] • 2 pts (edited )

People especially new gun owners are causing the shortage. I buy a hand gun and two boxes of ammo (100 rounds) now multiply that by millions of guns sold PER MONTH.

In 2020 Americans bought around 40 MILLION guns. That's 4.0 BILLION rounds if they also purchased 100 rounds for those new firearms. Now take that out to the fact that America has over 400 million guns in civilian hands. Getting the point why there is an ammunition shortage?

https://247wallst.com/consumer-products/2021/02/03/this-is-how-many-guns-were-sold-in-all-50-states/

There is no conspiracy it's supply and demand. What if you added 40 million more vehicles on the roads? Would it be a conspiracy that gasoline would be in short supply with a doubling or tripling of the price?

[–] [deleted] • 1 pt

Another thing aside from the probably manipulation is the sheer amount of gun sales. 40 million sales last year alone. Even if you only buy 100-200 rounds for each new gun that's a ton of ammo.

[–] • 1 pt

They're artificially lowering demand by trickling out actual supply

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