It is not beyond the realm of possibility that the guy talking about this has some experience with such exercises, because it shoul be understood these are exercises, and not simulations.
No it's not beyond being fake in large part on basis or as a whole. However it's solid in presented information. The choke points thing is a real issue. As are resources, as are who owns the guns, who owns the land etc. etc. etc. And further than "own" is who KNOWS the land. That's exceedingly important. Your rural "redneck hick" knows perfectly the geography of the 150 acre forest near his town.
Abstractions especially, used to 'gamify' these, both change the plausible strategies and tactics available, as well as determine whats available simply on the type of abstraction. A lot of government employees fail basic math, don't understand how to design experiments in order to test hypothesis beyond the mechanics offered, and over or underweight important details. They also have a habit of glossing over things that are in hindsight, important. What this means is that, knowing the government and affiliates are incompetent at some level, we cannot rely on the outcome of their exercises to begin with.
Yes. So those, even if armed; will be virtually useless in any scenario should it arise.
Take the morale problem as just one example of the dimensions of war that are glossed over or misunderstood in the design of the example exercises in the /k/ thread. Assuming the entire thread is not a government narrative to encourage people down a certain path (because even believing you can win is a perquisite to fighting)--assuming that, they gloss over morale immediately. How did tom do it? They won't discuss. It's left to us to insert our own opinions rather than look at the data. That doesn't tell us anything, which isn't terrible all in all, because most of us have some experience or knowledge to gauge new information by.
See above. That's a problem in all areas of the Federal Government. People are primed to abandon, subvert, sabotage the federal government. They're only in the positions they're in for the paycheck. Same with following policies.
But what it does tell us is that the game designers don't understand how morale works. They've gamified it by making it number, but by itself that number has no connection to the real world. It's outcomes are therefore only relevant to the tabletop exercise. What happens in the tabletop exercise based on a given morale number, will not tell us what would happen in the same real world scenario given the same "general morale" level.
just a number
I mean... yes? That's how game theory works. It takes likely probabilities and factors each other against others into a set of scenarios from which decisions can be made. The game doesn't have a scenario where the Moon hits the Earth for instance: that's a non zero but... it's 0 with regard to context.
And therein is the problem. Because thats even assuming morale can be sufficiently generalized. It's not that they can't learn things from simulation, it's that they haven't taken the time to actually understand their variables. Morale might not be generally measurable at all. It might be an ephemeral or emergent property measurable as a certain level of potential effective action by a party, but whose to say what those actions are, or what the outcomes mean.
Sigh. The other cap I recall goes over how some number for desertion, sabotage, etc. are handled. Fuck my life though of course I can't find it. But it explains how the majority of the government, especially armed forces would leave and train civilians. Where some smaller but still large portion would stay as moles. It further describes how the people that are the operators (/k/ term) in the military are the ones who "bleed red white and blue" and would never turn on American civilians despite the reason for the order. This is why there is a purging of these types in the military. It was started by neutering the IQ and fitness standards. Who does that leave filling in? Mentally Ill NPC troons who will join the 40% sooner than they would exist without their internet to go to.
Their big problem is legitimacy-focused grievance-based (reactionary) movements, which are forming all the time, all over america, like weeds popping up. They mow one down, three more form. Which is why they want to either lockdown and disarm the public and break them using the economy and CDC and DHS and other agencies, or pre-empt a civil war into a staged fight thats tightly controlled using informants and psychological operations and infighting, and blow steam on the lid before the whole thing blows up in their face. Predetermined outcome, and a public that loses the will for a bigger fight once it loses in the regime's national 'civil war' show-circus.
Agree. However this is the thing a lot of people look for: when does it end. I know for myself and many others the line is drawn in the sand VERY CLEARLY at any point where anyone comes and tells me no to something that's a right. There have been a dozen+ shoot outs with glowniggers trying to grab someone's guns where the person shot back, lasted; and got completely off. These aren't printed in the press for obvious reasons. But (and you'll need to trust me here, sorry) I recall very familiarly a few threads on fullpol (8ch) that went over these in detail. ZERO NEWS stories despite multihour stand offs with fedzogs.
I talk, and mostly I listen. To a lot of people. From all over. From all different sides.
Same. And despite how I act on poal, that's not me IRL. It's kind of a meme at this point. But the surprising thing is that the general population, while still far from being me; are moving closer toward me on poal than they are away from me on poal. (What I mean is how I write, behave, post etc.) Far more people are fed up with the jewishness than even most people on poal will admit they see themselves. FOR EXAMPLE: the number of times I say to people's face something derogatory about jews, say "nigger" etc. is effectively daily. The number of times I get concerted pushback is actually 0. This is further evidenced by the hilarious reactions I got for the last 2.5 years having NEVER WORN a mask. Not once. Ever. I didn't isolate. I was out, shopping going to the gym etc. That hilariously (sadly?) caused more arguments and actual police calls. The population is changing and it's turning into me.
rural v urban ...
Rural wins. Not close. Not like 60:40 or even 80:20 but like 999,999:1 (I don't mean deaths I mean some arbitrary number on what "winning" is)
I THINK I covered all your disparate points.... maybe? I dunno if I missed some at the start but it seemed to be a lot of description rather than arguing against the point.
The choke points thing is a real issue.
The chokepoints being real is immaterial to whether the variables and the mechanics generate scenarios and outcomes that accurately reflect the same scenarios unfolding in real life given the same variables.
As are resources, as are who owns the guns, who owns the land etc. etc. etc.
Thats what I'm saying though. They have some of the variables, undoubtedly correct, but don't understand how they actually operate.
And further than "own" is who KNOWS the land. That's exceedingly important. Your rural "redneck hick" knows perfectly the geography of the 150 acre forest near his town.
An underrated comment. Did they factor in stealth, camo, drone IR detection, counter-IR camo, vehicle IR and noise emission? Disguising vehicles IR signatures and moving at night? At what point did some tactic or strategy that was left out, cause their scenario to go sideways in the event of said scenario unfolding in the real world? At best it tells them what they should do, what policies and training they *should implement, based on what they expected beforehand--and nothing of what to do when the unanticipated occurs. Applying that same sort of thinking on our side, would be fatal.
See above. That's a problem in all areas of the Federal Government. People are primed to abandon, subvert, sabotage the federal government. They're only in the positions they're in for the paycheck. Same with following policies.
I actually didn't consider this, because the problem of enemy morale is almost out of sight when no opposition is organized to resist them to begin with. thanks. It does raise the question of whether enemy morale matters when public morale itself is so low to start with. A bad system can go on a lot longer than people think, simply on the inertia of no significant organized opposition or alternative.
The game doesn't have a scenario where the Moon hits the Earth for instance: that's a non zero but... it's 0 with regard to context.
I'm not talking about probabilities so insignificant that they can't happen in practice. I'm highlighting the problem of how tabletop exercises don't really say anything meaningful about real-world scenarios, as compared to just looking at the past and raw numbers.
Sigh. The other cap I recall goes over how some number for desertion, sabotage, etc. are handled. Fuck my life though of course I can't find it. Sigh. The other cap I recall goes over how some number for desertion, sabotage, etc. are handled. Fuck my life though of course I can't find it.
I've seen it, and know what you're referring to. Won't ask you to dig it out. I agree with the idea, though can't agree or disagree with the numbers because I don't recall them off the top of my head.
It's why I'm of the opinion that if there must be some sort of conflict, the regime would want a "controlled burn" so-to-speak, one where they remain in power afterward. Thats co-opted leaders on either-side of the conflict, indirect control of command-and-control, full insight to each sides respective internal communications and operations, etc. This isn't an original thought of course. But I don't have a lot of faith in humanity to anticipate this sort of subversion. The guys out there who would be first to jump ship, to get in early, are therefore likely to be the enemy in disguise. They're their to make sure you, and by extension all the veterans who turn rebel, lose in the long term. In the same way that a few bad apples make working with the police against the federal regime, impossible long term.
Trust placed in the wrong people, in the recruit that shows up out of the blue, in the random hanger-on and the sudden go getter that appears in an organizations very hour of need--gets people captured, tortured, disappeared, and killed. So then who do you trust if you trust at all? And how do you operate without trust, if at all? Are questions that would be asked by any scrupulous individuals in some sort of hypothetical civil war. They can't operate on the basis of credentials, because informants are everywhere. They can't operate on shit-tests because the government authorizes itself, and itself alone, it and its informants, to actively commit crimes against the state, which might otherwise be used to weed out moles and spies. They can't operate on recruiting people they've known a long time because the state sometimes spends months or years getting to know people through informants, or threatens the lives of people's families if they don't cooperate. And that on top of splitting public opinion by 24/7 indoctrination through organs of the DHS and secret police's propaganda, turning ordinary people into informants in the event anyone becomes 'too extreme' or radical.
This is why there is a purging of these types in the military. It was started by neutering the IQ and fitness standards. Who does that leave filling in? Mentally Ill NPC troons who will join the 40% sooner than they would exist without their internet to go to.
Mostly there to demoralize those who are capable, and once the numbers are low enough, fill the ranks with cartel, south americans, somalians, and other illegals. No attachment to america, means no hesitation for them to brutalize americans. It's why they're dragging out the civil war narrative, until they can get the correct military demographics to perform that 'controlled burn' I already mentioned.
I know for myself and many others the line is drawn in the sand VERY CLEARLY at any point where anyone comes and tells me no to something that's a right.
Very few people actually adhere to their red lines. It's part of the demoralization. Even fewer actually have a red line.
I recall very familiarly a few threads on fullpol (8ch) that went over these in detail. ZERO NEWS stories
I doubt everything I read, even from reliable sources, and thats not even counting the unreliable ones. Simply because of the amount of outright propaganda masquerading as 'alternative media' and 'discussion' by dudes wearing khakis in air conditioned well-lit mobile trailers paid for by the secret police.
Of course I have zero doubt that there have been standoffs and other incidents (such as train derailments) for which the state either offered zero coverage, or claimed the events were accidents.
It goes to the importance of having non-mainstream covert networks that are capable of putting out effective and frequent news bulletins about how any war is going in this scenario. Where the regime might rampantly deny it is fighting rebels, so as to deny and discourage the very existence of said opposition, it is not sufficient for an action-net to be engaged in a struggle against the regime, but it must also in the given scenario, assert both its right and necessity to exist on top of asserting that it in fact does exist to begin with. A thing can not recruit or be considered legitimate by the public when the public does not consider it to actually exist, or thinks its a larp. In this analysis, rebel supported news networks, covert broadcast and journalist crews, are not secondary or auxiliary concerns, but are in fact core to any movement, not just military movements.
But the surprising thing is that the general population, while still far from being me; are moving closer toward me on poal than they are away from me on poal.
Noticed this too.
FOR EXAMPLE: the number of times I say to people's face something derogatory about jews, say "nigger" etc. is effectively daily. The number of times I get concerted pushback is actually 0. This is further evidenced by the hilarious reactions I got for the last 2.5 years having NEVER WORN a mask.
Don't do this. Don't confuse the mask issue with race issues. Not because of optics, or 'appeal to muh moderates' but because its exactly what I would expect of an informant or a glowfag. It comes off as well-poisoning because the regime loves to associate its every issue with 'muh racism'. And it causes others with radars tuned to be overly cautious, to see it as the same, well-poisoning.
Thanks for the long-reply. I love those.
Don't do this. Don't confuse the mask issue with race issues. Not because of optics, or 'appeal to muh moderates' but because its exactly what I would expect of an informant or a glowfag. It comes off as well-poisoning because the regime loves to associate its every issue with 'muh racism'. And it causes others with radars tuned to be overly cautious, to see it as the same, well-poisoning.
You're right but I didn't mean to confuse the two I meant to point to two different examples of not following the (((rules))). But I see what you're saying. I'll try to reply to the remainder of the post. I'm busy right now. I'll delete this, copy paste above, and add additions so you get notified.
I'll try to reply to the remainder of the post. I'm busy right now. I'll delete this, copy paste above, and add additions so you get notified.
Cool. Talk at you later.
(post is archived)