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Scary case coming before them. Some might think that with the new semi-conservative justices, they'd side with gun rights, but those rino cuckservitives almost always side with giving the police more power.

Scary case coming before them. Some might think that with the new semi-conservative justices, they'd side with gun rights, but those rino cuckservitives almost always side with giving the police more power.

(post is archived)

If that were true, which it isn't, then Matthew 16:18-19 and 1 Tim 3:15 make absolutely zero sense. The Catholic Church is the only true Church, there are no others, just heresy and schism.

[–] [deleted] 0 pt (edited )

Explain the following Catholic principles using only the Bible:

Excommunication

Indulgences

worship on the lord's day instead of the Sabbath. (Here's the . Hint: the term "lord's day" appears only once in the New Testament.)

The revised 10 Commandments (also in that link above).

The practice of praying to angels and saints. (Pray only to God. John was told this by an angel in Revelation. The point is made in many other places in the Bible).

The notion they have the authority to ordain saints.

The rosary (repetitive prayer contrary to the direction in Matthew 6).

Oh yeah, one more. Vicarius Filli Dei. It's the pope's official title. It means "one who stands in place of the son of God." http://aloha.net/~mikesch/666.htm

There is much more. Let's start with this.

[–] 0 pt

You can't. The Catholic defense would be that doctrine derives from both scripture AND tradition.

[–] [deleted] -1 pt

Yep. And they'll claim the establishment of worship on the first day of the week instead of on the seventh day of the week is a mark of their authority to establish new traditions.

This is what is spoken of by Daniel in his Little Horn prophecy (Daniel 7:25).

And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

[–] [deleted] 0 pt (edited )

I'm not Roman Catholic but Orthodox Christian. Some of these are pretty easy to explain though.

  1. Vain repetitions would be more like the Buddhists etc who say "ommmmm". The words have no other purpose than to induce ones self into a trance, they also commonly used drum beats for this. If you're saying repeating a prayer is somehow evil then how do you explain the "our father"?

  2. We don't believe in a Pope so no qualms there.

  3. "Praying" is commonly conflated with "worshipping" to protestants, but this is not and never has been the meaning historically. It's a little strange because protestants create this definition of prayer being synonymous with worship, then use it against traditional Christians, when none of our prayers equate to worshipping saints but rather asking for help the same way you might ask a family member to ask God for mercy on your behalf.

  4. In the Orthodox Church we don't believe the Church excommunicates people but rather, by joining the Church and then violating it's core tenants you have effectively excommunicated yourself. People who aren't part of the Church can't be excommunicated. It's more of a formal declaration that this person is no longer with the faith than the Church causing someone to go to hell. Like if a priest says Christ is Satan, he's already excommunicated regardless of what the Church does or doesn't say.

  5. The Lord's Day isn't the same as the Sabbath. Those are two separate things. Even in the Bible if you look for the symbolism of breaking bread, you'll see it occurs in reference to Jesus specifically and occurs on the first day of the week, like Acts 20:7.

  1. When Christ spoke about vain repetitions he was speaking about and to the Pharisees and Sadducees. He was also speaking of their habit of going into the synagogue and making a public display of their faith. Christ directed his people to do their prayers in secret and to not engage in vain repetition. As for the "Our Father," that prayer is meant to be a model for how to pray. We can use it but we should also remember that God wants a relationship with us and relationships require more than repetitive ritual. They require us to talk to God about our problems, give thanks to Him for our blessings, and ask Him for help when we need something.

  2. Praying IS worship. Singing and all that other stuff is nice and worshipful but praying is sort of a big one. Another big one that is often overlooked is STUDYING His word. Christ said in the NT that where two or more are gathered in His name, there He is. He intended for us to gather and discuss, talk about faith, His word, worship, and come together to do the works we are meant to do. Let me ask you this, how many Christians have never actually read the Bible to any meaningful extent? How many only believe or even know what their pastor told them? How many can't even recall the sermon? Faith takes effort.

  3. That's fine for your Orthodox church. That isn't what the Catholic church claimed for centuries.

  4. Act's 20:7 notes that they were coming together on the first day of the week, eating together and talking to each other about the Gospel. They did this ALL THE TIME. The point of that passage was to establish the circumstances under which Paul fell to his death but DIDN'T DIE, which is covered just a few verses later. Furthermore, the Catholic Church, in the catechism I linked to, claimed that as a matter of its authority it transferred the solemnity of the Sabbath to the lord's day. It did this a bit over 500 years after Christ's death so go figure.

[–] [deleted] 0 pt (edited )

You have to understand that Catholics don't believe in Sola Scriptura because it's completely false. The Church codified the canon of scripture; ergo, she alone has the authority to interpret it, not protestants. Besides, even scripture condemns the idea of Sola Scriptura by history for one, and St. Paul himself: 2 Thess 2:14 "Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle." Scripture and tradition, that is what we believe, that is what has always been taught for 2000 years, until the protestant heretics came. So, it is ludicrous to believe that every doctrine is required by scripture since scripture is only one part of divine revelation, not the whole. However, there is no Catholic doctrine contradicted by scripture, it's simply impossible because that would make God a liar.

Ok, on to your "objections".

  • Excommunication

Matthew 16:18-19 "And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. and in many other places.


Sabbath

Jesus Christ rose from the dead on a Sunday. Also, we're not Jews. The Church has done this practice from the beginning, I'm surprised it's even a question. Christ revoked the old covenant and established a new one. The new sabbath is Sunday because Christ conquered death on Sunday and secured our redemption. And Acts 20:7.


The revised 10 Commandments

The prots moved them around, not us.

https://www.fisheaters.com/10commandments.html


The practice of praying to angels and saints.

https://www.scripturecatholic.com/saints-and-intercessory-prayer/


The notion they have the authority to ordain saints.

Again, I'll point you back to Matthew 16:18-19. Canonization requires a number of miracles to be performed by the saint after their death and their life determined to be one of heroic virtue. You can read plenty about this. Prior to Vatican II, at least 2 miracles were required as well as the "devil's advocate" panel during the canonization process. There is debate as to whether canonizations themselves are infallible, most theologians agree prior to Vatican II they were, but again it's still debated. Either way, I think 99.9999999% of Catholics would agree that canonizations prior to Vatican II are legitimate and trustworthy.


The rosary

Do you pray the Our Father? The Rosary is entirely scriptural. Christ was referring to pagans when he was talking about vain repetitions. Also, it's prideful to assume that all Catholics are vaingloriously repeating prayers to be seen. I would encourage you to read

and this: https://aleteia.org/2016/10/20/yes-the-rosary-is-a-completely-biblical-prayer/


Vicarius Filli Dei

This is pretty easy to answer. It English is translates to "Vicar of Christ". Meaning, Christ's representative on earth. This is consistent with Matthew 16:18-19 again. The pope has the power to bind and loose, Christ gave him this power and the keys to do it, ergo, He is Christ's vicar on earth, since Christ is reigning in Heaven and not physically present ruling over the Church on earth, except in the Eucharist.

I hope that answers your questions. I will pray for your conversion to the one, true, holy, Catholic, and apostolic faith outside of which no one is saved.